HOT DAMN!
The guy competing with Trump for the Republican Party most mentioned slightly trails Democratic Rep. Charley Crist who wants his old job back…..
What is going on here?
Could Democrats be staging a comeback down there post-Trump?
U.S. Rep. Charlie Crist narrowly leads Gov. Ron DeSantis in a hypothetical head-to-head matchup, according to the latest survey from St. Pete Polls.
The results come as DeSantis continues to face criticism for his COVID-19 response amid a major surge in cases and hospitalizations that is making Florida the epicenter of the pandemic.
While his lead is barely within the poll’s 1.6% margin of error, 45% of respondents indicated they’d vote for Crist, a Democrat who formerly served as Governor as a Republican, while just 44% said they’d cast a ballot for DeSantis. Another 11% are still undecided.
That’s a big step up for Crist who, in previous polls, was trailing DeSantis by as much as double digits.
A previous St. Pete Polls survey taken in late May found Crist in a much weaker position. Asked about Crist’s chances of beating DeSantis at the time, about 30% of voters gave the Congressman better than even odds to unseat the Republican incumbent. Another 38% gave him a 50/50 chance of winning, while 27% saw only a small chance of victory for Crist….
Note….
This is a very large poll (3, 000+) with a small MOE…..
The margin of the lead is….
Charlie Crist: 45.3%
Ron DeSantis: 43.8%
This particular Florida polling outfit had a very bad track record in 2018 and 2020 in terms of overstating support for Democrats… (and a big part of the reason why I went 0 for 3 in my FL statewide predictions those two cycles)
Other polls have shown DeSantis approval dropping as FL has become a COVID hotspot again.
MSNBC had a glowing report on Vermont’s GOP Gov Phil Scott and the low rate of COVID and high vaccination in his State–contrasting to similar sized South Dakota where COVID hospitalizations and deaths are much higher and vaccination rates much lower.
One would think Scott would be talked about as a 2024 contender for the GOP nomination rather than DeSantis and SD Gov Kristi Noem but in the Republican Party of 2021 any attempt to counter the virus is seen as disqualification.
Strange times for a weird death cult of a party.
Maybe Phil Scott can give some thought to running for President as an Independent..
On DeSantis, everyone (on both sides) should take it easy and wait about a year or so. The recent history in Florida has been though that Republicans wind up outperforming the polls and Crist is not exactly a political All-Star.
Sure.
Of course you can say that about most polls in any particular over a year out.
The way I remember the Governor of VT is that he is not Scott P, but instead P Scott!
DeSantis seems particularly vicious in demanding that municipalities and school districts “respect” the virus spreaders.
Pure politics.
DeSantis understands his Republican constituency.They have made “masks” the equivalent of “librul.”
Meanwhile Arkansas Republican Governor says he regrets signing into law an anti mask mandate passed by the Republican legislature.
This wave has been particularly severe in Arkansas which has avery low vaccination rate.
Hutchinson can make this statement of course because he is term limited and can’t run fir reelection .
I think liberals have made masks a virtue signal at this point. Pushback at this point should not be unexpected.
A couple weeks ago, I posted a column by Democrat Susan Estrich saying she was done with masks and people here said they agreed with it, but political messages have changed.
To be certain, before the vaccines, it was very important for the good of others to wear masks. Now, wearing a mask seems more like a political statement in most circumstances.
I am not suggesting that the mask scenario is not different for kids under 12 who need to get back to school. The FDA needs to move very fast to get vaccines approved for them too.
Public health officials continue to recommend masks be worn in certain circumstances.
I’ll take their recommendation over you and Ron DeSantis( or any other Republican for that matter).
Yeah I’ve gone back to wearing masks indoors sven though the new mandate in the St. Louis area has been suspended until it goes to court.
I know the vaccine works and will keep me out of the hospital or morgue. But I know several people who are vaccinated and have had mild cases of the Delta variant. I’d rather not have the inconvenience of getting sick, even though I’ll almost certainly be fine. If ambitious Republicans and their lackeys see my mask and think I’m “virtue signaling” or sone other term only heard in conservative media and among Trumpite Republicans U don’t give a fuck!
Indoor mask wearing is about 90% around my way inside and about 20% outside….
I don’t believe that for a minute james, but regardless, the CDC has said there is no reason for anyone to wear a mask outdoors.
Get vaccinated though. Please. Stop pretending that wearing a mask is just as good. It is not.
I don’t give a fuck
I guess, CG, that you were paying less attention than usual to the experts’ explanation.
Having been fully-vaccinated is almost 100% certain to save you from death and extremely effective saving you from a hospital stay or even severe symptoms in the case of a breakout re-infection.
However, the Delta variant is so virulent that a vaccinated person could catch the virus, be asymptomatic and still carry just as great a viral load in his or her nasal pharynx as an infected person who hasn’t taken a shot.
Wearing a mask (which I find to be a huge drag) in close indoor settings protects other people from catching that infection with all its horrible effects (whose survivors moan after the fact, “If only I’d taken the shot.”)
Even if the person you infect has had a shot, he or she might show no symptoms but still be infectious to others — and so on and so on (going viral).
This isn’t politics or signalling virtue (most of us would far prefer not to), it’s listening to and understanding the science (what CDC has been signally ineffective in communicating to the lay public).
As I said, the statistics show that 1 in every 1300 people who are vaccinated have gotten Covid. The risk of a vaccinated person passing it on is very low statistically. I would suggest doing your best to stay away from people who are unvaccinated, but that is for their good more than your own.
People have chosen not to get shots. They have to own that responsibility, just like the people who choose to shoot up heroin or not wear seatbelts, motorcycle helmets, etc.
I agree it’s rare but I happen to know 4 people from my office have COVID now and 2 were most definitely fully vaccinated.
Both vaccinated one’s are having mold symptoms but as I said wearing a mask for the time being in certain circumstances is about the most mild voluntary inconvenience imaginable.
So, it’s two that definitely were vaccinated and definitely have it. Statistically, it’s 2 out of 2600 then.
As I said, do whatever the hell you want, but what are the specific circumstances you feel that vaccinated people should be forced to?
I wish there was a way to do a flowchart here…
Q 1. Are you vaccinated- If no, wear a mask anywhere you go. Actually, you shouldn’t go anywhere for your own safety
If yes continue to Q2
Q2. Are you vaccinated and have Covid- You have about a 1 in 1300 chance of this being true.
if you know you have it, don’t go anywhere. Isolate until you are negative. Masks are irrelevant, you should not be around anyone.
If you have no idea that you have it and are vaccinated, you are part of well less than 1 in 1300.
Who would you be in close physical contact with that you know is unvaccinated? You probably should not be around them if you are worried about the risk to them. If they are eligible to be vaccinated and get Covid from you, that’s their fault. They probably are going to catch it anyways from an unvaccinated person rather than your own masked-self.
I’ve spent far more time arguing about this with you than I have putting on and taking off a mask.
I don’t begrudge any vaccinated person not wearing a mask now, I just want to minimize my risk for the time being. Once the Delta variant has burned through the mask can go back in the drawer. It’s just not that big a deal for me to wear it now. It obviously is for you so please save yourself some stress and don’t wear it.
As I said, you should do whatever the hell you want. Wear a mask. Wear a burqua, Whatever makes you feel better, The mask itself is not going to stop someone from getting Covid. It would stop others from maybe getting it. However, someone who is fully vaccinated almost certainly does not have Covid and thus cannot pass anything along.
Covid is never going to be completely gone. There will be other variants. Some people are always going to get it. Some seasons will be worse than others.
Politically, I believe that people on the right, when they should have been wearing masks, did not, in order to “own” the other side and make a stand. Now, when the science indicates that masks are not anywhere near as important, people on the left want to force others to wear masks in order to “own” them and make a stand.
My point is that the push for masks among the currently vaccinated is hurting the necessary push for vaccines for those who still need them and that will lead to more dangerous results. It is very likely that vaccinated people may need to get a booster shot, perhaps fairly soon. We may need to get Covid vaccines once a year. This messaging about masks as a substitute for vaccines or questioning the effectiveness or very point of getting the vaccine is going to make it less likely that reluctant people get the booster shot and their vaccination will wear off.
Once again as to masking or any other matter concerning this pandemic ,I suggest listening to public health authorities than the likes of CG and Ron DeSantis or any other Republican.
Since when does the science indicate that the masks are not that important or that masks don’t protect a person from getting COVID
19?
And what nonsense to say that it is almost impossible to get COVID it you are vaccinated? I assume you also believe it is almost impossible to die in a car crash, so why take safety measures on preventing a car crash.
I can understand your values in that risking others to death or serious illness is your perogative, but you don’t have to make shit up.
Sadly I think Jack is right on this one…sad that masks a possible public safety message is such a political issue, but that is really the Republicans Fault cause they don’t have policies they just have outrage to other policies…Which I can relate to in many ways, cause I don’t really root for sports teams now a days, I just root against certain teams or players to lose…
But sports and politics (real life money and lives) are very different stakes.
Are vaccines not a policy?
Quiz for people here:
Which is better in fighting Covid?
A. Vaccines
B. Masks
C Both are the same
D Neither
Eugene Robinson: “This is the GOP’s pandemic now. Cynical and irresponsible Republican politicians have created an environment that is killing Americans who shouldn’t have to die, swamping hospital systems with desperately ill patients, and generally ensuring that the pain and disruption of covid-19 are with us longer than they need be or should be. And they’ve done so in their own self-interest.”
“Yes, the more-infectious delta variant is driving this new wave. But vaccination and mask-wearing have the power to check that spike in cases, and to prevent those new diagnoses from turning into hospitalizations and deaths.”
“Can we possibly be so stupid that we ignore all empirical evidence and insist on inflicting grievous self-harm? Ambitious Republicans are betting that the answer to that question is yes.”
RRH….
FL-Gov: As a counterpoint to the St. Pete poll we had last week, here’s a poll commissioned by the Florida Chamber of Commerce that shows Gov. Ron DeSantis (R) with comfortable 8- and 9-point leads on Rep. Charlie Crist (D) and Ag. Comm. Nikki Fried (D), respectively. Polls are generally consistent on the following: Crist is leading Fried by a monster margin in the primary, he does slightly better head-to-head with DeSantis, but DeSantis is leading. The main question seems to be how bug the governor’s lead is.
People can do whatever the hell they want, but the CDC is saying that only about 1 in every 1300 people who are fully vaccinated have gotten Covid. That is a lot better than what was originally expected from the vaccine.
One would have to know a lot of people to know “several” who claim to be fully vaccinated and have gotten Covid if the rate is about 1 in every 1300.
I think pre 2020 and before we all heard of Covid, the risk of getting the flu, vaccinated or not, from someone in a grocery store would have been greater.
Several hundreds of people who were fully vaccinated have died of COVID-19. That may be less than the number of people who die from gun deaths, but it is far from insignificant. And that understates the problem. there are a lot of people still suffering from long haul COVID and some will likely die at least indirectly from the disease.
It is not as if a person who chooses not to wear a mask is making a decision that only affect themselves. Conservatives can mock people wearing masks for moral reasons. That is who conservatives are of course.
.
The statistics show that less than 0.0001 percent of people fully vaccinated have died from Covid.
Typically, that is an argument that is used by the anti-vaxxers as to why vaccines are unsafe or unreliable. The science says otherwise.
The number of deaths is actually about 1,400. Sad in every case of course. Almost all of them were also elderly or sick from other issues before being vaccinated. They were still right to get vaccinated.
But that is 1400 out of 164.2 million plus.
Zreebs is correct of course. We lost an old friend, a fully vaccinated friend, last night to COVID. He had been forced to sit in an emergency room for several hours to receive medical attention with people who sat mask less and refused to put on a mask even when the hospital attendants try to get them to wear one. Of course he was wearing a mask and thought he was protected — he got sick quickly and went down hill even faster due to pre-existing heart issues. Statistics are a lagging indicator in this situation given what is happening to the millions of people who actually venture out into the world everyday and don’t simply stay holed up in front of their computers.
My trainer is self isolating since he was exposed at a wedding last weekend, and he, although fully vaccinated, is feeling sick along with his girl friend. They both are responsible individuals, they won’t return to work until a doctor tells them them it is safe. How many people will be that responsible? After all, 74 million folks voted Republican last year, how responsible is that?
It is past time for all these spreaders to stay home. Why anyone would not be vaccinated at this point is beyond me, and simply stupid. Very, very stupid.
Emergency rooms should certainly require masks. I expect to be required to wear a mask to any doctor visit for the rest of my life and have a few scheduled for this month. That’s not what the debates are about though.
Again, less than 0.0001 percent of fully vaccinated people have died from Covid. That is far better than the experts could have hoped for.
It is an anti-vaxxer talking point to suggest that the vaccines are not working and it’s just so much easier to wear a mask.
Back to DeSantis, why should a governor with the stellar record on COVID like Phil Scott quit his party to run as an independent.
How broken in the GOP if he has to go and a Death Cult leader like DeSantis stays?
Because Democrats will not nominate Phil Scott for President.
Phil Scott and I both voted for Biden in 2020 and we would still be very unwelcomed within your political midst.
But I am speaking of options. There are several “good” Republicans that might run for President as Republicans and from my perspective could hopefully be nominated.
But on here, they are still “you Republicans.”
The option being that if a Trumpist wins the nomination again, then there should be an alternative for non-Trumpists, non-leftists.
The point is ideally it would not have to come to that.
I find it hilarious that the term “you Republicans “ seems to offend you.
I’m not offended if someone says “you Democrats”Indeed, you have often referred to the Democrats here as “you guys” when offering your “advice” as to what “we” should do.
You’re a Republican right?
I gave you the chance to clarify it. Perhaps you missed the post.
It sure seemed like you were saying “you Republicans” (including me) as a synonym of “you Trumpists.”
Did you mean it that way for me?
Or as it relates to me did you mean it as “you (mainstream, decent, patriotic) Republicans?”
Is it possible that the latter exists in your view?
As to the other question, “am I a Republican?”
Depends on what the meaning of the word “am” (or is) is. Technically, I am not. No voter registration here, Never has been. I have taken many steps in recent years to distance myself from any formal association with the party and have broken many former ties and associations I had to the party and to people involved in it. I think that should speak for itself.
So, I happen to be an American, who is a mainstream conservative I suppose. Both of us are likely to vote for some Republicans in the future.
That was hysterical. Twisted logic for the lunch “hour” today.
Keith has made it clear for years that I am akin to a Nazi sympathizer because I voted for Mitt Romney. So, I know where he comes from on the matter.
At various times you have continued to identify yourself as a Republican often with certain “qualifying” terms.
Whatever defining word you wish to place in front of it matters not to me.
Now you prefer to be known as simply a “conservative.”Almost all “conservatives” in the United States are identified with the Republican Party .Thats a simple fact that you are well aware of.Accordingly, it’s certainly not unusual that you would identify with the political views of most Republicans.
That was my only point and I think everyone here would agree with that.
Once again, I don’t understand why anyone saying “you Republicans “ upsets you so as even above you identify yourself as such once again with a qualifying adjectives.I presume “you conservatives” wouldn’t upset you as much?
As for voting for Republicans?Im sure that you will vote for far more in the future than I will.As we all know almost all “conservatives” ,which you identify yourself as, run as Republicans
Once again, I find nothing unusual about any of this.For some reason though, you wish to spend an inordinate amount of time being defensive about something that to me and I imagine most people here is simply self evident.
You are beating around the bush (not Bush) trying to call me a Trumpist.
Are you not? Do you think I am a Trumpist? You are unwilling to say (on here) that there is such a thing as a decent Republican, although I bet you probably hang out with some in real life, and maybe even some indecent ones too.
At the present time, you have voted for Trumpists and I have not. Not a single one. That is the difference and the hypocrisy you demonstrate upsets you when it is pointed out.
“You conservatives?” Depends on whether or not it is an issue I disagree with the people you are attacking on or not.
You should know by now that I do not share the views of Trumpists on a wide array of matters. It shouldn’t be a chore for you to make a distinction when talking about me or trying to criticize me.
No I think you despise Trump for what he’s done to your party.In some ways I feel sorry for you.
But getting all worked up by people here referring to you as what you most certainly are…a Republican?
Yeah that’s funny.
I despise Trump for what he has done to America.
I put country before party unlike many in both tribes.
You’re no more “ patriot” than anybody here.
I think everyone here puts the country first.
You can disagree with them if you want.Thats your prerogative but far too often you try to imply that in some manner you are morally superior to others here..
You’re not.
Am I less though? If you can say “no more, no less”, I can accept your view. Otherwise, I think it makes my point.
I specifically said ,”I think everyone here puts the country first.”
You’re “here.”
and you would get all bent out of shape if I referenced something I disagreed with or a crazy statement made by Ilhan Omar and specifically tied you to it by saying “you Democrats.” That is not something I do though.
You have previously made a big point in saying that you have not been to any sort of Democrat meeting in years and I shouldn’t even call you a Democrat.
I don’t care what you call me.
That’s another one of your many problems.
I couldn’t care less what you(or anybody else here for that matter) “calls me.”
Yeah, you definitely care. Almost anyone would. It’s a human reaction. You happen to fly off the handle a lot.
But why not just try to be even a bit more sensitive towards others feelings? If someone here tells me that they think I have been unfair to them, I at least listen and try not to continue doing that, unless I feel that the person is just a lousy human and deserves it, which only Keith counts as here.
I have to agree with Jack fully on this topic and wonder why our friend Corey Ray is so upset today.
And, like Jack, I really don’t care what he thinks of me or calls me for that matter.
But I do care to correct the record. When I referred to Nazis as it relates to the Republican Party and their last six (at least) Presidential campaigns, I was referencing the fact that the money backers to the Republican Party knew that their candidate was running a “dog whistle” racist campaign (especially against Obama). Just like the rich industrialists in Germany knew what Hitler was all about, but they simply wanted a vehicle to power. So they chose Hitler, the GOP last time out, chose Trump.
Everyone here knows that whether they admit it or not. It’s an apt analogy. Especially when we now have proof of what the Republicans did in their support for Trump.
His administration was a Republican Administration built on the years of the Party’s racist dog whistle messaging. These are facts, no matter how our friend tries to make this a personal insult to himself.
No apologies today Corey.
Nobody else agrees with you. They have said as much before.
They just dislike Republicans enough to not say anything to you and let your dirty work stand.
I still do not know where “Corey Ray” comes from. He is an African-American baseball player from Chicago who plays for the Milwaukee Brewers. Your history in attacking black Chicagoans is quite notorious so maybe there is a connection.
I feel like I would be cooler if my name really was “Corey Ray.”
You really are upset today. Try doing a little work. I personally am off for a run (sans mask).
But, everyone here does agree that Republicans run racist dog whistle campaigns. And, they also understand that people who claim to have an intimate knowledge of politics understand exactly what this racist messaging is designed to accomplish (whether they admit it or not).
Got to go, have a great day everyone.
Nobody else here agrees that Mitt Romney nor those that voted for him are comparable to Nazis.
They just stay quiet about the claim though because they aren’t the ones being compared to Nazis.
Well, you certainly are a Republican sympathizer even if you won’t admit it.
Curious as to who CG would vote for if he lived in FL. DeSantis or Crist?
don’t know. Won’t have to figure it out. Perhaps a third party or write-in.
I vote in IL and there are at least two potential Republican nominees I would not vote for.
If Democrats in FL want to maximize their chance against DeSantis they should probably hope for Fried over Crist to become the nominee. She has at least won statewide, while all the other Democrats have been losing statewide. Crist has failed in multiple statewide races now (as a Republican, Independent, and Democrat.. a David Duke like trifecta)
Demmings would have been a stronger candidate for Governor than either. Instead, she is running for Senate, which will be harder for her to win as a federal race.
Charlie Crist WAS the Governor of Florida…..
That WAS a state race…..
He won that race as a Republican, and has only won statewide office as a Republican. (I wanted someone else to win the primary. Never was a fan of Crist)
Nonetheless, he lost a Senate election as a Republican before he was Governor, and while he was Governor, he lost a Senate race as an Independent and after he was Governor, he lost a Governors race as a Democrat.
Trifecta of Failure
I have felt that DeSantis is trouble for Trump….
Sure he mimics him….
But he had to be a better politician
Crist looks good now
Wait
Democrats need EVERYTHING they can get in Florida which seems to have slipped away from them….
Unknown what the Florida Gov’s numbers will be after the Delta burnout which should coming
Something else that is noteworthy about Cris is that back when he was a prominent Republican, his detractors in the other party constantly claimed he was a closeted homosexual who was pretending to be something he is not, just in order to remain viable in the very conservative Republican Party.
Now, that he is a fully fledged Democrat, a party that is overwhelmingly pro-gay and with such an identification likely to help him politically, especially as it would relate to fundraising, all of that is now forgotten. He is just a stylish, skinny straight dude after all.
The Crist history throwback was unnecessary
By whom? His electoral history?
The bit about his alleged personal life when he was a Republican was said many many times online by many many people who wanted him to lose. Give me a break. None of this is a secret. I did not really care then or now if it was true which is something I would have addressed many times either on P1 or here when liberals brought it up. It is just interesting how these matters suddenly go away when there is a party change.
You certainly do not have a word of protest when things like that are alleged against Lindsey Graham, so again, give me a break.
For Graham also not needed to be brought up…
No secret…..
Unnecessary……
You better make sure you shut down all that Lindsey Graham talk from here on out if this is your policy. You never have before.
It’s free speech either way in my view. Public figures are called worse names and accused of far worse things on here on a daily basis than being gay. Maybe you consider it a bad thing.
I recall both liberals and conservatives making such comments about Crist’s personal life. In particular I remember that Confederate loving Kentucky Republican cracking wise about Crist who she viewed as unacceptably liberal.
I only vaguely recall the gay rumors about Crist.
https://www.miaminewtimes.com/news/charlie-crist-is-a-drunk-closeted-homosexual-according-to-porky-pig-6546453
Crist has been married and divorced a couple times. No one has ever accused the flamboyant Lyndsey Graham of even dating a woman.
Lastly, unlike Graham, Crist is not opposed to same sex marriage.
Crist changed his view on same sex marriage as have many people from Obama on down.
When has Lindsey Graham recently said he is opposed to same sex marriage? It’s not really a big issue anymore for almost anyone anymore.
I also do not consider Graham (or Crist) to be “flamboyant.” That would get into stereotyping but maybe others have their own perspective.
Let’s see if james will tell others to not accuse Lindsey Graham of these things.
The reason Graham is a piece of shit is of course completely for other reasons than being gay. And so, I will be amused at any story that is unflattering/embarrassing to Graham.
I never was a fan of Crist, but I would not describe him as a piece of shit. There are a lot of politicians from both parties whom I don’t like, and would never use that term for them. But Graham deserves it almost as much as Trump does.
A vote for DeSantis is a vote for Trumpism under another name.
DeSantis has (or at the least had) higher job approval ratings in FL than Trump ever did there or nationwide. We will see how his numbers look down the road.
Not a DeSantis fan but there is more to him personally and in terms of governance than his disingenuous embrace of Trumpism for political purposes.
I take DeSantis for what he says he is–a tried and true Trump Republican.
That he or other Republicans are “Disingenuous” seems like wishcasting at this point.
Just when are these pols going to start being themselves?
He changed in the Gubernatorial primary for an endorsement when he was the underdog. It worked. He is Governor now
Would be a mistake to underestimate him.
I still rate him the slight favorite to win reelection. Florida is the new home of Trump and seems to be shifting slightly to the right. Democrats shouldn’t give up there but unlike GA AZ or TX that are definitely tinting blue it seems to be shifting in the other direction–at least for now.
But what does they have to do with his Trumpism being “Disingenuous”?
Do you expect him or Lindsey Graham or Elise Stefanik to switch back? If so when ?
If only!
https://www.chicagobusiness.com/greg-hinz-politics/kirk-dillard-ponders-another-governor-run
More likely he might run for the open Secretary of State position.
Against a very flawed likely Dem nominee in Alexi Giannoulias, he would have a real chance there.
Dillard might wind up being the one Republican I vote for next year.
jack will probably find at least 2 or 3 in SC to vote for.
More humor….
He’s only going to vote for one Republican.
Yeah everyone here knows that I’m gonna be voting straight Republican.
So if you’re only voting for one Republican and the Democrats “suck”( a view you’ve expressed on many occasions,)whom will you be voting for?