Damn!
The guys worked tougher for decades in the US Senate !….
Joe Biden IS gonna be President in 2 months…
Donald Trump LOST….
Get with it Senator!
This is gonna be about 330 million Americans….
McConnell’s ongoing silence, even as the Trump administration moves to allow Biden to start his transition, leaves a question mark over what could be the most important Washington relationship of the next two years — between an incoming president who promised to tackle the nation’s most pressing concerns and the win-at-all-costs Capitol Hill operator who may well serve as his legislative gatekeeper.
The two men — Senate colleagues for 24 years and sparring partners in several high-stakes negotiations during Biden’s time as vice president — still have not spoken since the election, according to a GOP aide who spoke on the condition of anonymity to talk frankly….
…
“To the United States Senate, I hope these outstanding nominees receive a prompt hearing and that we can work across the aisle in good faith to move forward for the country,” Biden said Tuesday as he introduced the nominees.
McConnell has yet to acknowledge Biden is the president-elect, let alone lay out his thinking on the confirmation of a Democratic president’s nominees. But GOP aides say he is unlikely to orchestrate a complete blockade.
When Republicans controlled the Senate during the final two years of Barack Obama’s presidency, McConnell advanced several Cabinet-level nominees such as Defense Secretary Ashton B. Carter and Attorney General Loretta E. Lynch, while leaving dozens of judicial vacancies unfilled — paving the way for Trump’s remaking of the federal courts.
Note…
McConnell has been steady in advancing conservative judges during his tenure as Senate Majority leader….
image….The Seattle Times
You are missing the tea leaves…it is no longer about 330 Million, it’s about their tribe…If you take nothing else from the Trump Presidency it is about the tribe, it is no longer about the Country…CG said it best yesterday when he hears a Democratic Secretary of State from (what state, I can’t remember) saying this is about the country…he knows that the greater good the Republicans allegedly claimed they supported is not really their agenda…It really has never been their agenda, it’s that Trump has laid it all out for everyone to see…
Again, of course when he is gone the tune will change somewhat, but you will see obstruction like the Obama administration received from the senate…
What I referred to was that Tony Blinken, the nominee for Secretary of State, in his very moving remarks about his family, used the term “last best hope of Earth” to describe America.
It is a specific quote from Lincoln of course, that Ronald Reagan was very fond of and used often. I have never heard a Democrat use it before but was glad to hear it. I hope the concept of American Exceptionalism and being the indispensable leader of the world will indeed be at the forefront of the Biden Administration, because I believe that has been lacking the last *12* years.
I think “American Exceptionalism” is an outdated concept .
Here we are Richard Nixon’s “pitiful,helpless giant” where the Coronavirus is raging out of control and the simple act of wearing a mask ,an act all health authorities support as the best way to mitigate the disease, is opposed by much of the Republican Party for reasons so ridiculous as to defy simple logic, where science is mocked , and a major political party with NO evidence whatsoever declares an election illegitimate because their candidate lost.
There’s nothing. “Exceptional “ here.Instead we are rather ordinary much like countries that we formerly mocked.Now we are the object of ridicule by many of those that we blithely dismissed.
We deserve it.
I agree with Jack.
While There is part of me that wants to agree with CG that we are superior, the data indicates otherwise. Our handling of COVID-19 just might be the worst in the world; even third world countries are doing better than we are; people are dying at at increasing rate and the US Supreme Court argues that we are going too much.
Remarksbke, but very far from exceptional.
and which country is developing the vaccines in a very fast amount of time? Just as it has done in acts of liberation and extending freedom, such as the examples cited by Mr. Blinken, America is “the last best hope of Earth.”
In my view we have had poor leadership in the White House for the past 12 years. That is not the point. America has always been an Exceptional place, including the structure and willingness to better itself.
Those entrusted with leadership have the responsibility to speak to these things and live up to them. In the words of the President-Elect it is about the “power of our example” just as much as the “example of our power.”
Yeah we have really been presenting a great example to the world!
Your past(and future) Party says WITH NO evidence whatsoever says that the election was “rigged.”
What an example!
The Supreme Court today issues a ridiculous opinion that will likely sends hundreds maybe thousands to their death.
Gee the “examples “ never cease.
Oh and Im sure everyone notes your equating Obama with that piece of trash Republican in the White House.
You only see things as a lifelong tribalist.
My supposed “past and future party” has nothing to do with what our views of America should be,
And as I have reminded you before, you have voted for that party more frequently in recent years than I have. If it is ok for you then it would also have to be ok for others.
And the use of the word “equating” is about as intellectually dishonest as one can get. I am sure you actually realize that deep down.
Just because I found Trump to be a bad President and of course have described him as the worst person to hold the office, etc, does not mean that I have to somehow believe that Obama was a good President or that all things need to be considered “equal.”
Shades of gray, jack.
There ARE more Republicans who held their noses and voted for Trump then we will ever know…
They WILL remain Republicans….
It’s their choice….
He, he, he…..
Some of my friend’s are Republicans….
I can live with that….
Maybe on this Thanksgiving (whether a traditional one for us or not), some of us need to watch this ad and be mindful of the message, whether it might be an inconvenient one or not.
Yes everyone here knows that I’m a Republican.
Is that all you’ve got?
Pathetic.
But since you brought it up.You previously stated that upon Bidens election you would be part of ,as you described it ,“loyal opposition”.” You will be on Bidens case within a few months at best,maybe a few weeks.
You *have* voted for Trump supporting Republicans that others here, including myself, would not have, and yet you think you have the right to attack someone for how they *may* vote in the future.
That must make you pretty special.
And yes, I will state opposition to Biden when I think he is wrong. That’s part of being an American. Right now, I seem to be more pro-Biden, than a couple of you though.
Like I said, yes everyone here knows I’m a Republican.
And we all know that you are not.
It’s Thanksgiving, not April Fools.
You are not a Republican, but just occasionally vote for them. That should be fine but you seem to think that you should be the only one who gets to do that.
We know that you have had to prove how much you have disliked most Republicans for 55 plus years but I wish you would agree that someone being a Republican, past, present, or future does not make them inferior as an American.
As the Biden ad says, even when we disagree on policy, we should agree that we all love America and go from there.
No I don’t think that people who are even now claiming that the election was “rigged “ and are supporting efforts to steal this election are “ good” Americans.
Apparently, you do.
Obviously we disagree.
I have never said you weren’t a “good “American , “nor have I ,in any way, questioned your right to be a Republican
Indeed, I don’t even understand what your point is.
By all means be a Republican.I think we both know “ deep down” that’s where your heart is.
Ah?
Jack U ARE a GOPer?
And CG?
Again….
It’s UR business which party you favor….
And not all GOPer’s where happy or voted for the knucklehead supposily ‘leading’ the party to HIS defeat…
Some people will always be “sore losers.” You are giving them too much power. There has been no serious effort anywhere to actually overturn the 2020 election. What has been going on has largely been symbolic theater designed to placate an audience of one…
Did you have similar concerns about all those who felt that the 2000, 2004, or 2016 elections were “rigged” or “stolen?”
Some are best left ignored.
Heck, I actually voted for Biden and I still get treated here by *some* as if I had leprosy. Whatever. Everyone needs a “boogey-man” especially on the internet.
CG?
Again?
Be who U are….
Here ya gotta say why…
I havent noticed anyone treating you that way.
Everyone here engages with you.Do they disagree?Sure.So?
You seem to give as good as you take.Whats the problem?
And Jack’s right…
Ya should be able to take if ya give…
We have had people come and go because they couldn’t take the ‘heat’….
“Foreign observers observers are watching with trepidation and at times disbelief as coronavirus cases surge across the United States …”
Washington Post
Please, where is our “example?”
We come across as a bunch of whiny,entitled jackasses willing to sacrifice nothing to help our fellow man.
This is “exceptionalism?”
The actions of a group of people, or the proclamations of any President, or the act of any Congress, or the decision of any Court do not make America exceptional or non-exceptional.
America is exceptional because of what it has always stood for and tried to live up to, even when it failed to do so, we have never stopped trying. America has been the indispensable leader of the world and must remain so in the future, or the world will have far less hope.
When it comes to the virus, most Americans have gotten it and have acted with sacrifice and kindness. That does not mean we give up on or write off those whose behavior we have been disappointed in. It is American companies and American individuals, native-born and immigrant, Republican, Democrat, and otherwise, who will get the world out of this difficult period related to the virus, and who will one day use the example of such an effort to find a way to conquer cancer, Alzheimer’s and much more.
Yo one the foreign observers stories?
Bull Shit….
Things are just as fucked up back in most of their countries….
Some worst….
“American Exceptionalism” may be a misplaced word but millions of people seek to settle in this country every year….
Biden’s becoming President has been greeted by relaxing of shoulders around the world….
We ARE the world’s leader in military, economics and yes somewhat in culture and entertainment…
But?
In the last 4 years a crazed NYC Real Estate guy has been seeking to shitcan all of that for his own ego…
We are NOT perfect…
Nor are we ‘superior’
But this country is where a LOT of the world looks to lead….
Tony Blinken:
“For my family, as for so many generations of Americans, America has literally been the last best hope on earth. My grandfather, Maurice Blinken, fled pogroms in Russia and made a new life in America. His son, my father, Donald Blinken, served in the United States Air Force during World War II, and then as a United States ambassador. He is my role model and my hero. His wife, Vera Blinken, fled communist Hungary as a young girl and helped future generations of refugees come to America. My mother, Judith Pisar, builds bridges between America and the world through arts and culture. She is my greatest champion.
And my late stepfather, Samuel Pisar, he was one of 900 children in his school in Bialystok, Poland, but the only one to survive the Holocaust after four years in concentration camps. At the end of the war, he made a break from a death march into the woods in Bavaria. From his hiding place, he heard a deep rumbling sound. It was a tank. But instead of the iron cross, he saw painted on its side a five pointed white star. He ran to the tank, the hatch opened, an African-American GI looked down at him. He got down on his knees and said the only three words that he knew in English that his mother taught him before the war, God bless America.
That’s who we are. That’s what America represents to the world, however imperfectly. Now we have to proceed with equal measures of humility and confidence. Humility because, as the president-elect said, we can’t solve all the world’s problems alone. We need to be working with other countries. We need their cooperation. We need their partnership. But also confidence because America at its best still has a greater ability than any other country on earth to bring others together to meet the challenges of our time. And that’s where the men and women of the State Department, foreign service officers, civil service, that’s where they come in. I’ve witnessed their passion, their energy, their courage up close. I’ve seen what they do to keep us safe, to make us more prosperous. I’ve seen them add luster to a word that deserves our respect, diplomacy. If confirmed, it will be the honor of my life to help guide them. And so thank you all. And may God bless America.”
Well put!….
Screw Stephen Miller….
and THAT’tribe’ thing i miss is why Donald Trump lost his job…..
Calling America “exceptional” in the wake of COVID really feels like grading on a curve.
I don’t take any relish in saying that. In fact it hurts me. But that’s what the truth does sometimes.
I disagree with You James on the Tribe thing is why Trump Lost…He lost because of COIVD…nothing else, nothing more…if COVID never happened, that guys is being inaugurated again…This election was very simple, Trump versus COVID…
But what worries me about the McConnel refusal to support the president elecet and ultimately supporting out elections (which is convenient to say only where you lost was it fraud) and now the McConnel Court showing a glimpse of how things will be in a year with the mask ruling…anything Democrats try to do to push the country into the current century will be obstructed either by the senate or litigated in the Federal Courts now under the Republican Control…It is going to be an ugly four years…which will ultimately get blamed on Biden/Harris no matter the real story…and 2024 could see another swing back to the Republicans and their Ugly Tribal Pick (possibly Trump, possibly someone worse)…Worse in that they may actually no how to wield the power of the country to further the tribal agenda versus furthering their own ego agenda…on that we agree Trump used tribalism, he isn’t a tribal guy, he is a guy about himself, but the next Trump could be a Tribal guy, not just a guy out for himself and that scares me more in some ways…a true believer
Trump carried his ‘tribe’….
It wasn’t nearly enough…
The virus wasn’t the issue in Georgia, Arizona, Pennsylvania , Michigan , Minnesota…
Give me a break!
Donald Trump should have NEVER been President….
In the end?
THAT IS what cost him his job….
You cannot keep fucking 260 million of 330 million people and get out with ass in tact….
The guy was about HIMSELF…
THAT is NOT what an American President is supposed to be about…
Bdog?
The truth is some GOPer’s wasn’t enough…
Joe Biden got 80 million votes
And the electoral college vote won’t be even close….
James, you really don’t see it…the difference in the election is about 200k-250k total votes (in about 4-5 states) and last election it was even closer…Biden has to walk a tight rope to appease everyone where as republicans only have to appease Republicans…that’s a dance that isn’t easy to do even in the best of times…electoral politics are not in favor for the Democrats…it’s also not in their favor in the Senate if we break it down…Nationally as a whole Democrats poll well, but when it comes down to it…if there was no COVID those 250K votes aren’t going Biden’s way…
and as to the 80 Mil popular vote…California accounted for nearly five mil of his excess popular vote win…California doesn’t pick the President, Mich, Wisc, Penn, Nevada and Arizona due…maybe Georgia now, we shall see about that one, If we got rid of the Electoral College then I would say Democrats will almost always win the presidency, the Republicans only won one popular vote in the last 8 presidential elections, but they have been able to play the electoral system and the senate system well because they only have to appease their people, Democrats try to worry about appeasing all people and they wind up pissing everyone off…
Sure California is a good part of the popular vote….
It was in 2016 also and Hillary LOST…
The system was designed AGAINST the concept of a straight representative one person … one vote winner…
The people who put this place together didn’t trust that….
Been saying America is NOT a true Democracy
It’s a hybrid Republic/Democracy and the Republicans have managed to hold on against more Democrats and Indies….
Bdog?
The system IS working the way it was designed centuries ago…
2016-2017 was the exception as was 2008-2009…
After Jan we might have another exception if GOPer’s don’t vote for their party’s Senate people…
Please explain this statement..
“The system is working the way it was designed centuries ago
2016-2017 was the exception as was 2008- 2009.”
I have no idea what you’re talking about.
That one party control’s the executive and legislative branches…
Ok but that does not represent an “exception “ to how the system was “designed “ as when the Constitution was written, there was no contemplation nor consideration of political parties.
Check ur statement out Jack…
There WHERE political parties or factions back then….
There were political parties at the time the Constitution was written?
Name them.
Ok Jack….
How about these apple’s?
…’According to Washington, one of the chief dangers of letting regional loyalties dominate loyalty to the nation as a whole was that it would lead to factionalism, or the development of competing political parties. When Americans voted according to party loyalty, rather than the common interest of the nation, Washington feared it would foster a “spirit of revenge,” and enable the rise of “cunning, ambitious, and unprincipled men” who would “usurp for themselves the reins of government; destroying afterwards the very engines, which have lifted them to unjust dominion.”
In fact, political parties had already begun to emerge by the time Washington stepped aside. Federalists, who drew their support largely from New England, advocated a strong national government and the fiscal programs created by Hamilton, the nation’s first secretary of the treasury. Republicans (later Democratic-Republicans) led by Southerners like Thomas Jefferson and Madison, opposed Hamilton’s economic policies. They also split with the Federalists in foreign policy, favoring a closer relationship with France over Great Britain…’
Source…
I do mention factions ….
From DSD get….
…’Within the Philadelphia Convention, there were a group (call it a faction if you like) of anti-centralist delegates such as George Mason of Virginia and Samuel Adams of Massachusetts (as opposed to his cousin John), who thought the convention should go no further than simply amending the Articles…’
…
…’The weird system was not produced by parties, although once in action, engendered and shaped them…..’
Also…
How about it?
Irrelevant to the original discussion.
Pure obfuscation.
There were no political parties at the time the Constitution was drafted ,thus this “the system “so created didnt contemplate politcal parties .Accordingly, claiming ,as you did ,that one party occupying the presidency and another the Congress as an “exception” to the system so created is impossible as the existence of such was not contemplated when that system was created.
As usual you don’t even understand what you are writing.( and not what I am stating either)
Again Jack….
Political partiers and factions….
We have shown u several historical proofs ….
It’s up to u….
When the Constitution was being written in 1787 there really were no interstate parties as such.
There were disputes first whether the Articles of Confederation (1776) really needed signification amendment in the first place — in fact Rhode Island sent no delegates to Philadelphia and Alexander Hamilton basically represented himself rather than the State of New York or her citizens.
Within the Philadelphia Convention, there were a group (call it a faction if you like) of anti-centralist delegates such as George Mason of Virginia and Samuel Adams of Massachusetts (as opposed to his cousin John), who thought the convention should go no further than simply amending the Articles, and barring that, that the states keep as much power to themselves and surrender as little as possible to what those delegates thought would be a tyrannical, oppressive, despotic Federal authority too much like the monarchies of Europe and Great Britain.
When the Constitution was submitted to the several states for ratification, this group joined with others in each state to oppose ratification in the earliest incarnation of the Anti-Federalists. Similarly the friends of the new Constitution became known as Federalists.
Especially after George Washington’s second term, the Anti-Federalists did become a party, supporting the presidential candidacy in 1796 of Thomas Jefferson & Aaron Burr against John Adams of what had become the Federalist Party.
¶ But the push and pull of writing the Constitution, with all the weird compromises it produced (the Electoral College, the 3/5 Rule), came from divisions that were not in the form of what we call political parties and party platforms today — Virginia and the South against New York, Pennsylvania and New England; the nine smaller states against Va, Pa, NY and Massachusetts; slavery interests against anti-slavery, pro-tariff manufacturers against low-tariff farmers, parochialists vs nationalists vs internationalists (as in the clauses about diplomacy, treaties and Supremacy), no-taxers vs big spenders, those who thought a strong military to be necessary for a small, weak country vs those who feared that a strong military establishment threatened liberty, etc., etc.,
The weird system was not produced by parties, although once in action, engendered and shaped them. And in 1846-1865, proved itself utterly incapable of preserving the Union (hence Reconstruction, the 13th, 14th & 15th Amendments, and the Compromise of 1877.)
In other words, see my post @12:32.
somehow my reply to this specific reply of yours, Jack, ended up at the bottom of the thread.
That’s a pretty good analysis of the present political situation in the country.
Bdog got it exactly right.
The incompetence of the Republican Administration and its leader beat Trump and only Joe Biden could have won this election for the Democrats. Trump proved yesterday that he’s not going quietly and his smashing of norms has made our country anything but exceptional.
Our friend Corey appears to have had his own pity party here yesterday. He and James think things will return to “normal” once they force Trump out of the White House. If by normal they mean Mitch and the Republicans will return to their obstructionist ways, then yes. McConnell still won’t call a relief Bill, that’s the “one term” Mitch we all know.
The Senate, like the Electoral College, represents the minority viewpoint in the Nation. Fewer, white, uneducated and racist people. That is the foundation the Republican Party is built on, no wonder they spend so much time suppressing the vote. These people are anything but exceptional.
I KNOW Biden HAS TO dance with those who brought him….
I pointed THAT out here numerous times…
Been saying center RIGHT against the push here for center LEFT,..
I do NOT agree on the virus view….
Well I would suggest you join the Republican Party.They claim to be Center/Right and,based on your disagreement with my definition of them on another thread,I presume you agree.
Anyone who has the least knowledge of American politics knows that the Democratic Party is the Center-Left Party ,yet you seem to refuse to accept that.
He, he, he….
See what I mean?
We keep going around on this left/Right thing when Biden. won but the House almost escaped the Democrats…
Were Biden is CONTINUES to turn his back on the ‘progressives’….
I’m gonna KEEP playing my song here….
This statement is completely incoherent. A stream of consciousness disconnected from what both Bdog and Jack were saying.
Yes ,just more obfuscation .
He constantly answers any disagreement with something he’s said with an as you point out an often incoherent stream of consciousness response that has little ,if anything ,to do with his original remarks.
Except, Jack, that there was certainly “consideration” of parties, but almost entirely negatively (by the friends, but also I think by the foes) of the proposed Constitution.
James Madison’s famous Tenth number of ‘The Federalist’ argued, indeed, that the new Constitution would be a sound remedy for factions, both because of its federal (as opposed to unitary) structure and because it was republican rather than democratic (and almost all of the delegates at Philadelphia agreed, unlike us today, that a Republic was infinitely safer than a democracy).
In the antepenultimate and penultimate paragraphs of ‘Federalist’ no. X, Madison argued a point that was radically disproven in a very short time. The various local, state and regional factions did indeed unite into more-or-less coherent political parties with common national platforms. And today we would argue that more democracy (carefully considered) is what is needed, rather than the preservation of institutions like the Electoral College.
“Hence it clearly appears, that the same advantage, which a republic has over a democracy, in controlling the effects of faction, is enjoyed by a large over a small republic—is enjoyed by the union over the states composing it. Does this advantage consist in the substitution of representatives, whose enlightened views and virtuous sentiments render them superior to local prejudices, and to schemes of injustice? It will not be denied, that the representation of the union will be most likely to possess these requisite endowments. Does it consist in the greater security afforded by a greater variety of parties, against the event of any one party being able to outnumber and oppress the rest? In an equal degree does the encreased variety of parties, comprised within the union, encrease this security. Does it, in fine, consist in the greater obstacles opposed to the concert and accomplishment of the secret wishes of an unjust and interested majority? Here, again, the extent of the union gives it the most palpable advantage.
“The influence of factious leaders may kindle a flame within their particular states, but will be unable to spread a general conflagration through the other states: A religious sect, may degenerate into a political faction in a part of the confederacy; but the variety of sects dispersed over the entire face of it, must secure the national councils against any danger from that source: A rage for paper money, for an abolition of debts, for an equal division of property, or for any other improper or wicked project, will be less apt to pervade the whole body of the union, than a particular member of it; in the same proportion as such a malady is more likely to taint a particular county or district, than an entire state.”
The Federalist were a series of essays in support of the Constitution written by Hamilton, Madison and John Jay.
The above excerpt has no relevance to the point I was making that in the actual drafting thereof,those so doing didn’t draw up the document with the specific idea of “parties” as a part of the system.
Thusly,they could not have specifically contemplated “parties” as factor in generating an “exception “ to the system they were so devising.
I was trying to reinforce the point that you, I and also, I see, CG, are making: that although there were differences of interest and policy at the time the Philadelphia convention was drafting the Constitution, there were no parties in the sense that opposing parties could control the Executive, the Judiciary and each house of the Legislature.
I was citing Madison’s Federalist no. 10 because it was arguing that in fact the new Constitution was one that would obviate the possibility of nationwide parties — which, had turned out to be true, would have made partisan gridlocks between the Branches a meaningless idea.
¶As for James’ citation, Madison was writing in 1787. George Washington delivered his Farewell Address in March 1797, ten years later after the Constitution’s framing (by the convention, coincidentally, over which Washington had presided).
I already said that Federalist and anti-Federalist parties had formed by 1796 (supporting Adams or Jefferson & Burr) — which is the same thing that Sarah Pruitt at the History.com (History Channel) website was saying in her commentary.
But that’s not the situation foreseen by the Framers who gave us an Electoral College that, in only two decades, gave us 12 years of Republican presidencies when a majority of voters chose 16 years (not 8) of Democratic presidencies and only four years of G.O.P. ones.
¶ But James suffers from a Trump-like need to win every argument, to show that he was right even when he doesn’t understand the question. This isn’t a tennis match where every service must be answered. Nor is anyone (or should anyone) calculate points won as in a high-school or college debate contest.
When I’m mistaken (which I’m not ashamed to say that I have been far more than once) I sometimes acknowledge it or else stay silent.
I DO admit when I’m wrong here….
Something someone here fights worst than me….
And I DID say parties and ‘factions’ which there were….
There were no official political parties at the time of the Constitution but they certainly appeared to be inevitable even then. There was of course much compromise at the time between the North and South of the colonies that was needed to form a national government, and the Electoral College was part of it.
The same arguments for the Electoral College that exist then still exist now. We should remember that the Electoral College is still a far more “democratic” system of choosing a Head of Government than what most other democracies have. Very few places have true direct elections for a Chief Executive. Most democracies use the Parliamentary System.
In 2020, Biden won over 300 EC. His victory there seems more impressive than his popular vote margin over Trump. It seems like a waste of energy to rail so much about the Electoral College after this result, especially since it is never going to go away via the Constitutional process.
I agree the EC isn’t going away.
That’s why I never involve myself in those discussions.
Having said that I think it should.
But so what?
My opinion and a buck might get me a bad cup of coffee.
Indeed the EC IS part of the constitution and NOBODY is gonna mess with THAT least thing go off the hook in the process….
Sorry for the late quote, but James is correct that in 2000, and 2016 were as the system was designed, to subvert the popular will in favor of the electoral will…thats just a bit of cynicism there, you will for give me for that…