Federal Government Impeachment nearly means that a government official has been charged with misconduct…
It’s not a criminal charge…
The House is the prosecutor ….
The US Senate is the jury….
The Majority in each chamber of Congress has full control over how it runs things…
The Chief Justice of the Supreme Court prides over the trial in the US Senate , but can be overulled by the Majority in the Senate…
So?
We KNOW how Donald Trump’s trial is gonna end…
The media is running around breathless about this whole thing….
But there IS this….
Donald J. Trump HAS been impeached….Period…
Found not guilty?
He’s STILL been charged ….
THAT is IN the books….
But?
Anybody talk about the fact that Bill Clinton was impeached ALSO?
No, eh?
image…marketwatch.com
Uh,This is essentially what I’ve been saying for several weeks now.
And you’ve been critical of me claiming that I didn’t “ get” it.
And now lo and behold you have concluded it,”isn’t that big a deal.”
What happened?Did all those uh “greys “ go away and you’re now seeing things as black and white?
MY point was it was/is chewing Trump up INSIDE….
And we ARE seeing the facts and hypocrisy,,,
We ALWAYS KNEW what the result would be…
No greys here….
Politics….
To NOT have had an impeachment as I originally thought was wrong…
Nor am I in a hurry as you are…
As to not beingin a hurry?
Irrelevant.
See your own post here today, the charges are being sent over .The “trial” will commence in a week or so probably.
It’s possible the whole thing will be over in a couple of weeks.
Like you say,
Uh No Big Deal!
yeah Riiiigt!
In other words, it’s a”big” deal until it’s not?
Silliness.
Another example of how you write so much gibberish that you end up contradicting your own gibberish.
Jack?
U know ANYBODY that liked getting indicted by a grand jury?
Roger Stone?
He might enjoy prison bonding.
Remember…..
Bill Clinton was ALREADY in his second term…
Yes, and his VP lost because his opponent was successfully able to make the case that honesty and integrity needed to be restored. Gore and his people were afraid to even be seen with Clinton for that reason, even though there was a great perception about the economy and foreign relations. Clinton would go on to lose his law license etc over his perjury.
There is a ton of peril for Trump politically in all of this. I don’t know why Democrats would want to fight it (unless you are U.S. Senator running for President who is missing out on face time in the states) Let it happen. It’s the best bet you have.
No.
And what does that have to do with anything.
Trump doesn’t “like” being impeached?
No he doesn’t.
Like you said though,
No Big Deal
I don’t get this post at all.
Yes, intelligent and informed people know that Bill Clinton was also impeached and are able to talk about that.
And yes, it was and is a “big deal” for both he and Trump.
Whatever one assumes the “verdict” will be, nothing is pre-ordained politically.
New information keeps coming out such as the very disturbing news about the female Ambassador possibly having faced a threat. We don’t know what may come out and how it may hurt Trump. He should have had a “huge win” on Iran last week, yet the polls show basically no movement.
The only thing saving him (besides a perceived strong economy of course) are the very serious and growing divisions among Democrats and the disconnect that so many Americans feel towards that party.
Opinions about Trump have actually been rematkably consistent almost since his election and his approval/Disapproval rating seems to move in a very narrow range.
I don’t see that changing regardless of any”new information .”Republican support for him remains overwhelming and will certainly not change greatly due to this impending impeachment trial.
After his certain acquittal ,I expect his approval/disapprovals to remain within that narrow range.
You have no way of knowing that. You have to concede his overall base of support is low and thin. It’s not like the Democrats are knocking it out of the park these days in regards to their favorables. You have to push the Trump negative angles constantly. It cannot be underestimated how many people voted for or “support” Trump, to this day, not because they like him or much of what he is doing, but because they fear the alternative.
What should scare people the most is exactly what Trump has done in terms of thinking he is above the rule of law and endangering national security strictly to placate his own political and personal ego.
The Democrats should be salivating at the chance to prosecute all of this in the court of public opinion but are doing a less of stellar job in doing so. (In part because they have excused so many in their part of so much for so long)
You have “no way of knowing” lots of things you say here.
We will see shortly if I am right or I am wrong.
Trumps certain acquittal will have nothing to do with your opinion of Democrats ,which we are all familiar with ,but with a pack of cowardly Republican Senators who wouldn’t vote to convict him even if there was video recording of him telling his aides that he was guilty as hell.
They would simply say he was joking.
Nope this coming acquittal is strictly on the hands of the Republicans in the Senate
The bad thing though is that they will be proud of it!
And his overwhelming support (near 90% )among Republicans.
Odd you didn’t”mention” that.
He needs far more than Republicans to win again. Not even if he had 100 % of Republicans. Stop acting like only Republicans are to blame for this. Try to get the voters back that you lost to him for starters.
Oh I will continue to blame Your party for this “psychopath “ as you describe him.
They nominated him.
And yes their votes elected him.
Trump has 90% support among Republicans and considering his approval rating is in the low 40s the percentage of Republicans among his core supporters is roughly that same 90%.
So Republicans deserve at least 90% of the blame for bringing us the abomination that is Donald Trump.
Sounds right to me.
Work on your 10 percent of the problem first then instead of complaining.
We did in 2018 and 2019 and will continue to do so in 2020.
You work on actually getting a candidate you can support this year.
A flesh and blood one that actually exists.
You already know which of the 12 Democrats I said I would vote (unenthusiastically for). Anyone else who might possibly be nominated in the current field is unacceptable as is Trump.
So, I guess it is up to you Democrats to work on nominating the candidate who might be able to get people like me to cross over, even with great reservations. But if you go hard-left, the blame will be in the mirror.
I still won’t vote for Trump, but a lot of your past voters will be doing that. That’s not the Republicans’ fault.
It is also true that since 2017, I expressed support for the election of at least three statewide Democrats running against Republicans.
Scott and jack said they couldn’t win and people who thought otherwise were foolish or wasting their time but they did win. I often think Scott and jack enjoy bitching about Republicans more than they ever would Democrats actually winning.
If Democrats DO come out like the midterms?
The projections of Trump losing the popular AND Electoral vote WILL BE correct…
on the front page of this place I have forecasts of a Democratic President win this November ….
Republicans came out pretty strong in the midterms too. Picked up Senate seats in conservative states, etc.
The Democrats did net a lot of House seats, but those that won Republican leaning districts tended to be considered moderates.
They were not likely to be Berniecrats or Warrencreats and they were not pandering the way Biden has been to the left wing special interests.
So, of course it depends whom you guys nominate for President.
If it is someone seen as very far to the left or who would put the entire economy in jeopardy or who has expressed foreign policy ideas that people fear will harm America, then there will be a large turnout to oppose them too.
Sure, you will still win the blue states easily. It won’t nearly be enough though.
I get that Scott and jack want to wait until the last possible second to pick a candidate (I think because they don’t want others to make fun of them if the candidate fails) but this is certainly getting to a point where logical Democrats need to really focus on electability, both in terms of the person, and the message that person will run on to the country at large.
Dem’s need Florida, Pa, and Ohio or Arizona
Could Biden bring back the Obama to Trump defections?
If 2018 is your point of reference, Democrats probably cannot win Florida and Ohio and Arizona would be hard as well.
Democrats did seem to make significant gains in PA, MI, and WI, three states that were expected to easily be Dem in 2016. Examine the types of candidates that were able to win statewide (or in competitive CD’s) though and compare and contrast to Sanders, Warren, and others.
Election Projection and Bicoffer (sp?)
Give Ohio, Wis, Mich, Fla and Pa To Dem’s/Biden who is leading in those states Right Now….
Again?
The pundit predictions 10 months out are for Dem’s 300+ EC’s AND the popular vote…
Right now, Biden seems to be trying to assure Democrats that he will be more liberal than Obama on immigration, trade, troop deployments, etc.
Might work with those who will never dream of voting for a Republican but maybe not so much with the ones who switched from Obama to Trump.
I explained the Obama immigration policy thing here before….
short version
Obama , who was a terrible deal maker at first went hard on deportations to try to notice GOP er’s to do a deal on legislation …
THAT did not work….
And it got latino’s pissed at him
in his last years he let up…
…
Because of Trump’s noise he’s scared away people from trying leaving Obaba’s numbbers actually higher than Obama…
Obama did catch and release so he never had the detention issues Trump has had…
Biden i would assume would go back to catch and release ….
BTW?
Per Fareed Zucari?
Most Americans do NOT FAVOR straight up open borders
But DO favor robust immigration in a humane manner…
Last i heard Stephen Miller wanted to ship illegals out of the country in boxcars like the Germans during WWII…
Trump is gonna run on his wall and immigration ….
Biden knows this
Wait Jack….
Trump did do a hostile takeover of the GOPer’s
This bullshit again James?!
The Republicans created Trump, their hatred of the black guy gave Trump all of his talking points on the way to his nomination.
How prejudiced does one group of people have to be to nominate this racist clown?
Rhetorical question.
Doesn’t the word “hostile” imply more than token opposition?
And “token opposition” might even overstate the GOP response. The most opposition we can expect is Susan Collins verbally expressing concern before she casts her vote in support of Trump.
CG?
IF something comes out that caused the GOPer’s turn on Trump?
THIS WOULD BE A BIG FUCKING DEAL….
Then you and I can co-author a book called “The Art of the BFD.”
He, he, he….
50/50!
I didn’t think Trump would get a “huge win” on Iran for a couple of reasons.
1. Knowing Trump I knew deep down that the imminent threat was likely exaggerated.
2. Much to your chagrin it is not 2004 anymore. People are sick of unending Middle East wars and the calls to rally to war from Republicans like you are having much diminished returns.
Part of the Iran problem for Trump is Barack Obama hatred….
CG loves to criticize every one else’s candidate of choice because he has no real living candidate he can vote for in Nov. 2020.
Reminds me of people who criticize every one else’s mate–yet they go home alone. Because no human can actually meet their ridiculous standards.
Odd logic at a later hour-
Not everyone’s “candidate” or “partner” is right for the other person. If they are right for you, great. If you feel good about voting for someone in Nov. 2020, then more power to you. Of course, that candidate can also be criticized. That’s what the free market of ideas entail. Not everyone thinks alike. At no point would I ever tell you not to vote for anyone, but yet you seem to want to tell me how I should vote, even when we know we have different beliefs or values.
However I choose to exercise my free speech via the vote in November 2020, it will be something that I find acceptable for myself. Whatever criticism you have of the person will be completely your right as well. It’s easy for me to separate the two.
Also, that mindset cannot be reconciled with being upset at me for “settling” for Alan Keyes in a Senate race or any other vote I cast that you would have done differently. I am more willing to “settle” in a down-ballot raee than one for the Presidency.
I choose to look at the positive and know that in the first five Presidential elections I voted in, I was very proud to vote for the person in all of them, in terms of what kind of person they were, and in four of those cases, with strong favorability towards what kind of President they would be.
We may not have a democracy left after a Trump 2nd term.
If you don’t want to “settle” and choose to sit on the sidelines- that’s your right. It is also my right to point out how stupid that is.
In 50 years no one will give a shit about whether or not the person who could have defeated Trumpism met your standards. What will matter is that you didnt even bother to cast your vote to stop Trumpism.
Sounds like a classic case of “projection.”
That’s ok. I can take it.
If Scott feels that my lone vote in Illinois next November will decide the fate of whether we have a democracy or not, then he should be willing to heed what I have said and commit his part to making this nomination happen.
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/478494-bloomberg-viewed-as-having-best-chance-to-beat-trump-in-betting-market
I think more likely though Scott just wants someone to be mad at.
When tbe popular vote totals go up I want to point to that last digit and say that’s what I did to end Trumpism.
End of story.
By not voting for Trump I do the same.
I also want to be able to say I did what I could to prevent Sanderism, etc.
CG, What do you think that Sanders has a reasonable chance of accomplishing that you disagree with?
I don’t think he will ever be President.
Who knows what kind of Executive Orders he may seek to implement if he were though or what threats he may choose to ignore.
And I think he would nominate the wrong people for the Courts.
CG, And what are your primary concerns about a sccond term of Trump?
Same as the first term.
He’s a lousy human. A lousy human should not be President.
You didn’t mention the following?
1) threat to democracy
2) threats to our institutions
2) executive orders such as legalization of baby jails
In as much as I did not care for Republicans such as GWB, I never really thought when he was in office (for example) that “a free press” was ever in danger. I do feel that way with Trump.
Don’t you have similar concerns?
I’ve had similar concerns in the first term, especially about our institutions and the very nature of “truth.”
Of course those concerns do not go away. Historically though, a lame duck President has less power. I don’ think he has the capacity to “end democracy” and I think our Constitution has guards against the wrong kind of Executive Orders. I note that Democrats have said they will use his example to try to do things by Executive Order that they cannot get thru Congress, so both parties are culpable.
With regard to CG’s comment that 2nd-term (lame-duck) Presidents have historically had less power [including the power to corrupt the Republic], I just don’t think that what might or might not be true of the President’s general policy holds for threats to the constitutional-democratic system.
It’s true that the most sinister and dangerous shifts towards executive power under George W. Bush after 9/11, but Woodrow Wilson’s wholesale assault on civil liberties and political pluralism happened in the year after his re-election.
Ditto for Richard Nixon. The Executive Order that interned hundreds of thousands of Japanese-Americans was issued in FDR’s third term. And I think the most oppressive parts of Harry Truman’s campaign against subversives occurred after his 1948 return to office.
Some of this is no doubt due to the years in which the U.S. went to war, but I can’t think of any examples where a President (other than G.W. Bush) was more dangerous in his first term than in later terms.
Second-term Presidents have been seen as less successful and more vulnerable to scandal.
There is no real point in debating the GWB Presidency here, but I would think most leftists would be upset about what happened during the first term more. He certainly made the decision to go to War in Iraq in the first term.
The second term, which certainly saw economic problems, that were beyond the U.S.’s control to a large extent, had a bit of a different foreign policy approach in regards to how the war in Iraq was executed, definitely in the last two years, when Dick Cheney is believed to have been basically sidelined. Remember, GWB was completely impervious to all the requests that people (including Cheney, rightly or wrongly) wanted him to do in regards to pardons on his way out.
No it doesn’t, It’s a vote for “other”. A throwaway vote
If the “other” is the best option, I want history to record my vote for “other.”
I trust if any of the white people here were to ever be sent to prison, they would not join the Aryan Nation prison gang just to fight or be protected against a black gang or a Latino gang in the prison (or vice versa.)
Sometimes conscience dictates standing “alone.”
I don’t get the analogy. Are you comparing efforts to protect your re-election efforts to be the same as efforts to protect ones life?
I am using an extreme analogy. Neither party is a “prison gang” but the point about tribalism stands. In my view, it is not worth selling one’s soul just to “make a point” or to engage in something you know is wrong just to be on the other side of something else that is wrong.
And if you want to take my prison gang analogy literally, then yes, I would say it would be more honorable to die than to join or pretend to join the Nazis and potentially kill others, just to save yourself.
As Ronald Reagan said in his famous 1964 speech, when America was faced with the threat of imperialist Communism, it is not better to “live on your knees” than “die on your feet.”
Yet you constantly harp on Scott and I’s preference to wait and see how the field evolves before declaring our candidate preference.
Indeed, hardly a day goes by that you don’t mention it.
Based on an earlier post yesterday , apparently, you are eager for us
To so declare so you can “criticize “ our choice (as you are opposed to every viable Democratic candidate it’s obvious you will oppose our choice).
So it’s good to know that you now believe in our right as you say the “exercise our right of free speech” by declaring ,when we so desire ,whom we will vote for in our respective primaries.
Since that is your opinion as expressed above you certainly can no longer criticize our due diligence in making our choice.
I’ve mentioned it all but twice and said that I understand why you want to wait as soon as possible. I think you are afraid of james harping on your choice if it isn’t Biden. AlI I have said is that logical Democrats need to think really hard about elcctability if they are serious about beating Trump.
Great analogy Scott.
There really is only one issue this year, the removal of Trump from office, and that is up to the voters since the Senate Republicans are too afraid to do their Constitutional duty.
Real Americans will vote for the only candidate who can beat Trump. Hint, the Democrat!
In other news, did anyone watch Lev last night? He threw Pence under the bus.
On the basis of his interview it seems the Ukraine has opened an investigation into the threats against our ambassador. So Trump finally got his investigation.
Yep Keith
In light of all this new damming evidence it is imperative Trump be removed from office in November.
The Democratic nominee will be the only person who can do that. And that’s why my vote will be that last digit in the total of whoever is nominated to defeat Trumpism.
Ok guys try to move to another post if we’re NOT talking about impeachment…
Know it’s a pain…
Thanks…
The jury has been sworn in.
Let’s hope the bailiff does not have to break up any fights between Sanders and Warren.