Team owners hoping to make Donald Trump happy have passed a rule that would allow fining teams that have players kneeling during the National Anthem to express their displeasure with America’s progress on diversity …
Donald Trump has been on the owners case to stop their players, mostly minorities , from expressing their views thru the actions…Those same players HAVE done numerous activities that support police and military families and agencies…
Anybody think that ALL the kneeling is going away?
The NFL Players’ Association (NFLPA) on Wednesday criticized the league for its new national anthem policy.
In a statement, the union said it would review the new policy and “challenge any aspect of it that is inconsistent with the collective bargaining agreement.”
The union accused the league of contradicting its previous statements, and of ignoring players’ wishes in developing the new policy, which instructs that all team and league personnel should stand for the national anthem.
“The NFL chose to not consult the union in the development of this new ‘policy,’” the union said in a statement. “NFL players have shown their patriotism through their social activism, their community service, in support of our military and law enforcement and yes, through their protests to raise awareness about the issues they care about.”…
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So the National Anthem is meant to stand for every American value except the spirit of the First Amendment?
What if a player is the loyal citizen or subject of another country, or adheres to the beliefs of the Jehovah’s Witnesses (whom the Supreme Court ruled back in the middle of World War II don’t have to join the rest of a public-school class in reciting the Pledge of Allegiance.*)
Oh, say, does that star-spangled banner yet wave o’er the land of the free and the home of the brave?
* See Minersville School District vs Gobitis (1940), counteracted by West Virginia State Board of Education vs Barnette (1943).
Some might, and will, argue that as a private association of private employers, the NFL isn’t constrained in the same way as government entities, but the NFL’s monopoly powers derive straight from Congress — it’s not as if Colin Kaepernick can go play major-league football outside the NFL for a non-league team or for the AFL or USFL team across the street.
I think it’s very simple.
Anyone who chooses to get paid to participate in an event should stand for the anthem of the country where the event is taking place out of respect for the people in who’s country the event is being hosted. They don’t have to sing or agree with the anthem or do anything else.
Of course, it should also be stated that this new NFL policy allows players to elect to stay in the locker room for the anthem. They are not being forced to participate in the anthem.
Seems like a reasonable compromise for all.
NFL teams used to not even come onto the field until after the playing of the National Anthem.
No one particularly noticed.
The last time this base-rousing issue came up was as an out-of-the-blue distraction when Trump was failing badly at something else (I think disaster relief).
Maybe it’s returning now since there’s a very good chance that the foreign-policy initiatives of the last month or so could all blow up soon in the ugliest possible way in (among other places) Iran, Iraq, Syria, Palestine, Israel, Japan and Korea.
After all, John Bolton has never believed in international agreements and alliances, although it’s hard to see what alternative he has if it isn’t war. NATO now faces its greatest strain since the Iraq War and perhaps since Vietnam. The extremely-delicate understandings that brought both Russia and China into the non-proliferation negotiations with Iran and North Korea may very well snap and fray, with almost no prospect of being re-knit together. Trade policy has now become a completely-incoherent mess.
Who knows what can happen next ? Everything could still turn Trump’s (and America’s, and the West’s, and Israel’s) way, but I think the opposite is far more likely.
I think the NFL saw declining television ratings and stadium attendance and decided they had to do something so that this is not what people are talking about next season.
I profoundly disagree with the concept that John Bolton is some sort of isolationist or someone who has not believed in traditional American alliances.
It’s his job now to do what he can to prevail over someone like Trump to whom those things might apply.
Mike Pence is on twitter declaring all this a “victory for President Trump.”
That will likely inspire a flurry of kneeling particularly in the early games, fines, penalties ,etc notwithstanding.
The New York Jets owner is saying he will pay any fines levied against his players.
The NFL has inadvertently probably stirred this whole non issue back up.
The same NY Jets owner who is currently the U.S. Ambassador to the UK?
I don’t think there will be much in the way of these protests next season. Those who choose to will just stay in the locker room.
Oh just like you claiming that a lot of Republicans “react” to Democrats criticizing Trump by rallying to him,
I suspect that there will be some players who will react to Pences post (and Trumps inevitable “victory lap”) by kneeling,particularly in the first game of the season,
There are still a few months before the season starts. Of course, the Trump Admin is going to gloat. No surprise there.
I think by the time the pre-season games start, this isn’t as big of a story.
I also suspect the NFL players who want to kneel sort of realize they are in a lose-lose position, so they will just stay in the locker room and save face.
It is also worth nothing that the NBA has long had a policy mandating that players stand, on the court, for the anthem.
noting*
It’s not a “big” story now to some people.
It’s a “story” among a lot of people who demand “respect” for institutions they revere ,while defending a bastard who daily besmirches the institution of the presidency, arguably as great a symbol to our country as a song.
I find the actions of a few paid athletes far less a “story “ than this.
This story is about how Donald Trump has managed to maneuver and issue to his advantage
Just like with non-racial situations?
He just wants things bent to his way….
The racial part is the sweetner
I do believe the guy is afraid of people of color actually….
On the Adams win
I gave her a 30% chance
Jack is probably gonna be closer with his gas…
We’re talking about Georgia
She will do good in the big cities like Atlanta
But will have HUGE problems in rural counties
But with Obama and Trump surprises?
Who knows?
Oh, and i’m sure. There IS gonna be kneeling
Come the fall by NFL players
Ya can’t fire 10 or 15 of the teams Black players along with White players also ….
The NBA is a bad example
That league is 95% Black
Owners can’t afford to piss off the brothers
BTW?
I believe the min salary for pro football and baseball players is what?
Are you asking us what you believe?
I agree with Dave that this is a first amendment issue. Kneeling is not only NOT disrespectful, it is actually exceedingly respectful, and it is an appropriate nonviolent way of drawing attention to racial injustices.
This ruling will not make this issue go away. The players will simply adopt a different tactic. Isn’t that obvious?
The First Amendment begins “Congress shall make no law respecting ..”
The First Amendment is about the government and what the government cannot do. The NFL is not the government. Anybody who plays in the NFL does so out of choice and is amply rewarded financially for doing so. Now, they have the freedom to stay in the locker room.
I understand some players may be upset about this, but they nor their supporters should conflate this with a Constitutional issue.
They, as American citizens, have the same rights as any of us have, to vote against Donald Trump, to speak out against him online or publicly, or to whomever we want, as often as we want. There is much to speak out against and I hope they do so.
Unless we are our own boss though, I doubt any of us has total and free rights to political expression in the workplace.
The NFL as a private business, consisting of numerous franchises, has a right to look after its bottom line and this matter was clearly affecting it negatively. Kneel before the game, kneel after the game (as many players from both teams do together), but when the anthem of a country that hosts the ticket paying spectators (or the anthem of a country for a team being represented) is being played, the athletes and able bodied paid personnel on the field should stand as a matter of respect to the people to whom the anthem means something.
Maybe
But American Pro Football had some issues BEFORE. The kneeling thing….
A violent sport….
A settled lawsuit for $750 Millon for concision long term effects…
Parents had already begun to shy away from the game…
Playing football isn’t cheap
The cost of equipment is steep
There are a LOT of American football teams
And Canadian teams
And Flag teams
And Females with little clothes
Etc….
Football has been on the decline
I will be VERY SURPRISED if this edict from the owners does what Trump wants
I phrased it poorly. Yesa private company can limit free speech. I remember about 15 years ago a former employer of mine (NCCI) banned the American Flag from the workplace after 9/11. It was legal for them to do that, but stupid and inappropriate.
It’s a grey area at best….
An employee cannot tell you to extremes belivesvdifferent from ur own
But can direct you to not do something that might make the organization look Bad when u are reaping the oygsnization
Jets manager pushes back on NFL policy decision…
New York Jets chairman Christopher Johnson told Newsday that he will pay the fines for players on his team who protest during the national anthem, hours after the NFL announced a new policy penalizing players who do so.
Johnson said that he never wants “to put restrictions on the speech of our players.”
Politicalwire…
The National Association for the Advancement of Colored People (NAACP) criticized the NFL on Wednesday for its decision to ban players from kneeling during the national anthem.
“Protest is an American tradition; by protesting we work to hold our country accountable to its highest ideals,” the NAACP said in a statement. “Instead of coming together to address an issue disproportionately plaguing the African-American, the NFL owners have chosen to bury their heads and silence players.”…
The Hill….
Meanwhile, Trump says those kneeling” might” ought to be thrown out of the country.
Now, THAT would be an actual First Amendment issue.
Trump will NOT win the kneeling duel in the end….
Reuters report of the President questioning whether players who disagree with the NFL policy should stay in the country; plus NFL players’ (mainly-negative) reactions here::
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-football-nfl-athem/trump-asks-if-nfl-players-who-protest-should-be-in-country-idUSKCN1IP1J9
Especially since those players , like immigrants are mostly of color fits into Trump’s mind set….
Typical Donald Trump ego boasting that is sure to get the kneelers ire and make things worst….
NBC News
@NBCNews
JUST IN: President Trump tells Fox & Friends that he thinks NFL players should “have to stand proudly” for the national anthem, and suggests that they “shouldn’t be in the country” if they do not stand.
He knows he can’t toss uppity black football players out of the country for kneeling–but he also knows FOX News viewers love this kind of racist unconstitutional talk.
And Republicans who are not retiring will let it slide.
Pathetic.
See:
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2018/5/24/1766764/-The-Daily-News-pulls-no-punches-with-today-s-front-page-calling-the-NFL-ownership-unpatriotic
and
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2018/5/24/1766882/-The-NBA-s-Steve-Kerr-on-the-NFL-it-s-fake-patriotism-it-s-idiotic
The push back will continue against Trump’s BS attack againstfree expression in America….
The owners, wait….SOME owners, are gonna put themselves in a BAD place…
True THAT Scott….
He may get nowhere with most of his window dressing….
But his true believers LOVE hios bull shit…
If Donald Trump won’t respect the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, then maybe he shouldn’t be staying in this country, either.
(Not that Australasia, the Americas, Africa or Western Europe would want him, either. Maybe he can try Russia, Poland, Hungary, Saudi Arabia or Israel.)
Here, here!
Did you mean “hear, hear” in which you implore others to listen to DSD’s words or “Here / Here” in which you are demanding that Trump stay here – and not go to Russia, Poland, Hungary, etc..
Applauding DSD shout out !😃✔️
Of course, Donald Trump never really answered Mr Khan’s question, “Mr. Trump, have you even read the Constituion?”
Apparently he got stuck somewhere around the emoluments clause (near the end of Article II, section 1). TLDR
Trump couldn’t care if he lived in America or Russia….
As long as he’s getting HIS…..
There were racist people who were offended by the Cheerios commercial with a little girl in a bi-racial family, but when confronted; the General Mills chairman told critics to stick it. And Cheerios did just fine.
The NFL handled this poorly. Many NFL teams had stadiums built with public money, and so it is appropriate to ask each of the owners how they voted. The fans have a right to know.
I read where there actually never was a formal vote.
Instead a “ consensus” was reached and announced .
Apparently,however, some weren’t part of the “ consensus” as was evident when the Chairman of the Jets immediately announced that the team would pay any fines imposed .
True THAT Jack….
This IS gonna be a mess for the League….
Again…
Trump rarely gets away with a ‘clean’ win on anything…
Even after a week or so, I still find the NFL position very upsetting. It seems tome that the NFL is deliberately embracing people who are largely indifferent to police brutality toward black people and their appeasers like CG.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2777821-nfl-anthem-policy-demonstrates-what-little-regard-it-has-for-its-black-players?utm_source=cnn.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=editorial
Well, you can be certain you are in the distinct minority of Americans with your opinion.
The Washington Post reports 53% believe that kneeling is never appropriate. But even if 99% believes that, it doesn’t mean I am wrong.
I would like to know the make up of the sample for that poll…
There is also a big difference between “never” and the relevant specifics involved in the situation.
Yes, of course, you should stand by your beliefs, even if you are in the 1%. I think that also means though that you should at least understand why so many people feel differently.
I agree that some of the people genuinely believe that kneeling is disrespectful.
And I believe that some of the poll respondents who answered “never” would quickly change their minds on the appropriateness of kneeling if the reason for the kneeling to was show support for police officers “who were provoked by black youth”.
Members of Congress found a partisan divide over the NFL’s new policy on players kneeling in protest during the National Anthem….
Roll Call…
“One day, our nation’s flag will drape my coffin, just as it did my Dad’s and will my husband’s and brother’s,” U.S. Sen. Tammy Duckworth (D-Ill.), a veteran who lost both of her legs in the Iraq War, tweeted Friday along with a photo of her prosthetic legs.
“I will always stand on these legs for the flag and anthem, but it was ALSO my honor to defend people’s right to free speech including those who choose to #TakeAKnee to express outrage at the glaring disparity in how Americans of different races are treated.”
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2018/5/25/1767163/-Senator-Duckworth-has-words-for-the-NFL